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Hello Rook,Welcome, I also train Wing Chun, as a matter of fact I met Sifu Robert Chu when he had a school in NYC some years back. I am still new to training in AKTS but I will say that the Triangle Exercise seems to be relevant right from the start of training. For such a simple appearing exercise it covers a large number of concepts. The sweeps, Sapu and Besets are trained while doing the triangle exercise as well as proper placement of the feet for various entering exercises. The hand techniques supplement the foot movements but that can be confusing at the start. One thing I found helpful when training the triangle was to do the footwork without any handwork at all. I would cross my hands behind my back and do the footwork. This allows me to concentrate on the footwork first and then slowly add the hands. Something which I found opened a lot of things to me was grasping the concept of needing to turn the opponents body or offset his center in order to apply a Sapu or Beset effectively. One thing my Guru always says is that the hands do what you want. The keys are in the footwork. I find this to be true in Wing Chun as well. My current Sifu, Chung Kwok Chow, has told me my hands are very good, maybe close to his. However, he is able to defeat me with his footwork each and every time. Of course, now that I am training AKTS that may not always be the case. Although, do not missunderstand and think there is any competition between my Sifu and I. He has my respect and is a friend!!I do not know if this post is of any help or not. I have much to lear before offerering advice to others. But maybe you will find something of help or interest in this post.
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Middle GA?? We may be neighbors, lol. Actually I live just North of Atlanta but my door is always open if you ever get up this way. There are some options for Wooden Dummies one of which is here: http://www.woodendummy.net/I use an old tarp for my triangle, luckily I am divorced so no wife to complain
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Thanks for sharing. While I like the drils shown, for Silat I would like to see more footwork. One of the things which Silat is known for is the ability to vary levels, up to down etc. With the traditional WC Dummy, a good Silat player could, imho, utilize the lower leg for Sapus and Besets.Also, by lowering the stance you can use the First and Second Circle stances and make contact with the lower leg for pracice of grabs and potential take downs.Just some thoughts later at night. Like it though. The last one is interesting and may be more relevant to Silat practice in some ways than the traditional dummy. The main idea behind the WC dummy has to do with the angles of the arms and space between them. When done correctly, the dummy will refine onces WC techniques. While able to be adapted to other styles and methods, the design is for WC at the core. Of course, my opinion is that WC and AKTS fit together like hand and glove.
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Hi John,The traditional Mook Yan, the Tripodal and Plum Blossom poles are all found in Yip Mans lineage. I believe Augustine Fong, or some of his students have the poles inserted in the ground at one of the schools in AZ. The tripodal dummy is normally three upright posts which form a triangle. A practicianer can practice kicks as well as footwork/moving steps/stances. Normally the height of the posts is about 5-6 feet. The plum blossom posts can be only a foot off the ground or several feet. Depending on the height of the posts one may also be able to practice kids as well. In some instances the height of the poles will be somewhat higher to allow balance training in a more intense manner. In some advance cases the poles will be of different hights which puts another stress on blance and footwork. You can substitute paint cans for the poles for the plum blossom poles. Practice stepping on them to improve balance and practice footwork. As to the Bamboo Dummy this is not found in Yip Mans lineage, as far as I know, but in the Sum Nung family. I do not think it is seen or practice outside of that family, but I could be mistaken. Dave
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Wing Chun has a few different types of dummies or Jongs for training. The Mok Yan Jong which is the traditional dummy. There is the Tripodal Dummy which is essentially three posts placed in the ground. The Plum Flower Steps which is Five Posts driven into the ground in the flower patern one center post and four outer posts representing the petals. These can be combined into more than one so that there are different designs thus greater fotwork patterns. There is also a Bamboo Dummy which has up to nine "arms" projecting from it for training. Of course with the modern age there are also "Chi Sau" dummies as well. The Tripodal Dummy and Plum Blossom posts are traditional and help with footwork and also practicing kicks.
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Hello,While I welcome the opportunity to interact with Uncle Bill, I would caution anyone from making any comments which could be contrued in the wrong way. This represents an opportunity for healing and perhaps increased interaction between the two families. It would be a shame for any comments to be taken the wrong way and result in this failing. With that in mind I would humbly suggest that we leave the past in the past and focus on today and the future. Anything which happened in the past between Uncle Bill and Sigung Steve should be between them and, imho, does not need us to stoke the flames. Having said all of that I wish to extend a Welcome to Uncle Bill and say that I for one am appreciative of the opportunity to obtain answers to questions which I may have for training.
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Hello,Okay, so here is my question:It seems that there should be five (5) stances in the Basics for the DLP. However, when I count them out I get seven (7) not five. I am wondering if someone could give me the actual stances we should be practicing for the DLP. So far I have been trying to do the Malabar Leg Set but this is different that some of the AKTS stances I see particularily watching some of the Peer videos. Right now I am of the mind that for the Basics the following is what I should be focusing on. All comments are appreciated. DLP Basics/Stances1. Turning Stance – Stationary2. Turning Stance – Turning Feet3. Turning with Arm Cover4. Diving for Pearls5. Indexing6. Tiger Stance – Kick7. Eagle StanceTriangle Training• Triangle Exercise• Triangle Exercise with Punches
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Art,I will go back over the tapes and I am sure I will have more questions ;DSince I am older, I will go for the easy way. Any chance of learning like Wesley Snipes did in Demolition Man.............while I sleep? I have been going through the Malabar Leg Set and the ones giving me trouble are the Dragon Tail and King Cobra and Monkey. I am also trying to figure out how to jumpe and do the turn, I may be too stiff for these yet, but I can aspire to doing them. Thanks again for the clarification.
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Art,Thanks for the clarification. I am trying to insure I am training properly. I may have missunderstood something which was said to me. What are the differences between Malabar and the DLP? I know that some of the DLP incorporates things from Malabar, but I am wondering at what point that stops. For example, are the Jurus Malabar or can they be part of the DLP as well? With the New Year I am trying to get back on track with training seriously and I want to make sure I am on the right track. Thanks,Dave
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Hello,I was unaware of all of the "politics" within the system and reading this thread has opened my eyes. Still, I feel right at home here as I come from Wing Chun which is also very much infected with infighting. It must be a Chinese tradition to teach students the wrong way and keep the "real" knowledge for the chosen few, as it seems to be a often encountered technique. Although, to be fair, most of the "real" techniques were the same with minor differences. When I left my first WT Organization I was also threatened if I ever taught anyone. I was also told that all of my ranking was now voided. I remember laughing as I told then that they could void my rank within the system/organization but could not take back the knowledge I had gained. It is sad to see when family does not get along. However, that mirrors life as well since many families outside of the arts also do not get along. I believe this is part of the curse as well as a result of the "confounding of mans language at the Tower of Babel". Perhaps by keeping us in strife it insures that we will never ever see our full potential. Neither as man nor as martial artists. Anyhow, sorry for the rant. I just wanted to let y'all know that Wing Chun and its infighting is far worse in many ways. The bottom line for any of us, IMHO, is to train and move onward to better ourselves. To hold no ill towards one another and to strive to be the best we can be. One thing that our "family" can do which is of benefit no matter what, is to hold each of us accountable, but to do so out of a spirit of love and not anger or hate. I know I am a lazy one who does better with someone holding me to task..............though that does not mean I like it
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Hello,I would be interested in any pics or designs which could be used. I am unfamiliar with "pankars" coming from a Wing Chun background. I have used, and am using, a Triangle on a Blue Tarp for doing Triangles and some basic footwork orientation, so far it seems to be working okay. Fortunately, I have a rather large living room area so I do not need to worry about it blowing away. I would love to see more details about this type of training.
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Hello Elijah,I regret that I will be unable to attend the training in Colorado. Unfortunately, my finances and my status as a single parent will prevent me this time, but there is always next year. I recently was awarded custody of my three girls and now that this is out of the way I am taking them to visit with their mother. I will be bringing them back to Georgia the first week of July. However, I wish you all the best and am confident that one day I will get to meet others and learn from their experience in the art. Besides, I always wanted to visit Colorado
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Hello,I will try my best to make whatever date is decided upon. I live about 1 1/2 hours from Guru Derric so I can be flexible. Although, I may be traveling to Philly to let my kids see their mom sometime during the second week of June. For those who have not had a chance to meet and train with Guru Derric, I would highly recommend doing so if you have the opportunity. I, in my little time thus spent training with him, have found him to be not only knowledgeable but a very nice person as well. Thus far I have found him to exemplify the spirit of AKTS. It is rare to find the combination of solid knowledge with a personable pleasant person so take the chance if you can to train with Derric.
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Hi Art,Perhaps "commercialization" was a poor choice of words. What I meant was the goal of spreading the art further and making it more accessible to others, although not necessarily with the goal of making money. I do think that to make the art more widespread, a structured approach is a good asset. Of course, that is just me and I have always been a bit thick headed
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Hello,I guess it goes to the intent of the training, what I mean is whether it is to be commercialized for the masses or done in a more intimate setting. Most traditional training in China was done with no real set pattern, it was what Sifu wanted to teach at that time. The thought was that the student would remain with the Sifu for life, or at least a very long time, so the Sifu could teach what he wanted how they wanted as the student would eventually be exposed to everything the art had to offer. Here in the West we seem to bounce around more and few stay the distance before venturing into something else. In addition to that is the fact that many today need to have some sort of recognition of their training and "accomplishments". Hence the addition of the belts etc. Of course, one needs a structured approach in order to have recognizable levels. Sticky Hands is found in several arts and is an excellent way to develop attributes. I believe that the highest form is always free and flowing. The goal is to react naturally and leave set patterns behind. The question on my mind is which is the best way to accomplish this goal. I always like to go back to the alphabet or mathematics. While the highest levels are freeflowing and can invoke much thought. The start of both is very basic and it is upon those basics that the more advanced is built. With so many training without access to a Guru or advanced partner, a basic structured drill at the beginning may open doors for more quicker advancement. I know myself, that Derric has corrected flaws in my stances and opened my eyes to some other possibilities. I can imagine the frustration of training a particular way only to find it was incorrect from the start. Besides, as Derric can tell you, years of training to do something one way and then trying to change is not easy as I am still very much back weighted.
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Hello,I think that the idea of breaking the drill into defensive and offensive components is an excellent starting point. The first drill is Dan Chi Sau or "Single Sticky Hands". While it is true that each person both attacks and defends, the basic movements are broken down into their simplest terms. It is a sensitivity drill after all. Adding the aspect of a knife to Sticky Hands makes it a much less forgiving environment. After all the slightest touch would and could result in a cut. Still, IMHO, if one limits the attacks and responses, in the beginning at least, then one will be able to develop the core attributes and build from there. At least this would or should provide a means of steady progression.
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Hi Art,It seems that concepts are in abundance ;DI can see the value of both approaches, head turning and still. Seems to me that AKTS is really about freedom of expression using the concepts and techniques to fit your own personality. Can't wait to see where I will be in six months and then a year.
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Hello,Had the opportunity to work with Derric today. Got a glimpse of some of the sensitivity training. It seems to me that there are some drills built into the training to develope the necessary attributes for this aspect. I have a long way to go before I can offer anything, but it did get my mind working. I also had my eyes opened to some of the aspects of Triangle training which I had missed. I am about to roll out of my crib and start to crawl
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Art and Tim,It seems I have much to learn ;D But that is a good thing!!I am currently taking the lazy approach, practicing Triangles and the first two stances, really haven't looked over Djuru Satu as I figured the footwork was more pressing at the moment. Art, you reference 13 stances, I thought there were five, again I have much to learn. I must admit after seeing Sigung Steve demonstrate some of the low stances I am of the mind that I will be hard pressed to do anything like them
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Naturally, the goal is to use the djurus, but the free-form expression allows for each individuals past training to find a useful application in play.When you watch Sigung Steve's sticking hands, you will see mostly djurus, but also a lot of the Shaolin animals and the Internal Taoist strikes as well ~ depending on who he is playing with and what he is trying to teach them.
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Hello Tim,I hope I do not come across as criticizing the current program, nor like I am trying to reinvent the wheel. As I have said, I am new to AKTS and certainly need to develop a foundation in order to developer any skill whatsoever. In Wing Chun there are many who follow the status quo and train the same way today as they did many years ago. There are others who embrace more modern training methods and intergrate other approaches into their own personal Wing Chun. Both are valid approaches and each has its strengths and weaknesses. One simply needs to keep an open mind. My desire for standardization is more for insuring a set skill level throughout as well as for marketability. I am sure that the programs for, Law Enforcement, for example, had specific goals and trained for those end results. Anyhow, I am here to learn and hopefully attain some small measure of skill.
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Hello Art,Well, not so sure I have anything to offer, but I will talk to Derric when I see him next. I think that when people already experienced come to the art then they are able to adapt and learn with minimal structure. However, it is always nice to have some standards. Think of it this way, you can navigate from one point to another with only a compass to guide you. But, isn't it a lot easier if you have both a compass and a map?
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Hello,The traditional way of teaching was to train whatever Sifu felt like doing that particular day. As I mentioned before, this is fine provided you have access to train with Sifu and your seniors on a regular basis. But, what happens when you don't? The end goal always must be to react naturally and spontaneously, however how does one reach that level and how can it be done more quickly? Consider the whole school platform. There is a set curriculum upon which one builds upon basic skills. Consider reading and writting; while I am sure one could obtain some level without a set series of basics upon which to build, isn't it easier to first learn the letters, then the different things associated with those letters in sequence, then sentences and so on.............only after learning and building on the basics can one write, whether it be a simple sentence or a riveting novel. The basics do not limit ones writting, rather they free it. Also, once the basics are grasped they can be thrown away, consider how many professional writers fail to follow the rules of grammar. It is the same with mathematics, while some can do high level calculations by nature, most require a foundation on which to build. IMHO, particularly for those in a program like the DLP, a set of reference to build upon which is standardized across the board could be of value. Especially for those new to the system or those without someone to train with on a regular basis. In a sense this already exists with the various requirements needed to achieve the different levels. All I am saying is it may not be such a bad idea to say that level 1 has this and this and this is how we punch and generate power at this juncture. Once that idea is grasped than one must personalize it and make it their own. Sensitivity can not be learned by rote. Just mimicking the movements in Sticky Hands will not get you anywhere other than a robotic sequence in a set and predictable pattern. However, again just my opinion, when one first starts out and does A+B=C as a means of understanding the platform of Sticky Hands. One can learn much faster as they have that base upon which to build, then once they have that base they can begin expanding and writting their own interpretations. I am not saying that "playing" with someone will not allow you to grasp the sensitivity. Only that, unless you are very gifted, building that base first with a common denominator of movements may accelerate understanding and allow one to progress more quickly. Also, it allows for that standard for when and if you visit another school, at least they know where you are in terms of progress. However, like I said, the nonstandard approach is the more traditional way and does work, just may take a little longer, imho.
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Hi Art,I think I will have my hands full just trying to get the footwork down. As Derric noticed when we met, I tend to remain weighted 100% on my back leg. This is how we did it in Wing Tsun and while I have trained other lineages, I always seem to revert back to this under pressure. Of course, in my own defense, I did spend years and many hours training to do just that, rear weighted stepping. I have also forgot most of the sections, remember the goal was to make everything natural. Still, I do have my old notes and could probably do the first 3 or 4 without too much problem. On a side note, does AKTS have any drills similar to Hubub or De Cadenama (not sure of the spelling but it translates into something like "Chain of Hands")? I remember one of the things my Pekiti Tirsia guy and were doing was trying to incorporate the Wing Chun and the Kali drills into a single blended exercise. Very nice flow potential there. However, once I have a foundation within the AKTS I would be willing to try and work with my seniors to video and do something. Although, you may be better off without me
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Morning,I have had a chance to look over the DVD's and also to look at several of the files online regarding the DLP. First off let me say that there is a good deal of material which is presented more than once. Several of the videos contain material which can be found in others as well. However, I do not view this as a bad thing as it only serves to reinforce the training. I found the quality of the videos to be very good, especially when one considers that they are not "professionally" produced in a controlled environment like a studio. I do see how they seem to be geared more towards those with some experience and may not be the most suitable for a complete beginner. Not because the material is not there, but because often a beginner will have a myriad of questions regarding leg placement, hand movements and power generation which are not covered in great detail. However, this is one of the drawbacks of learning from video, you often miss things because you fail to grasp the nuances. All of this can be rectified with the occasional training with a senior in the art. Coming from a Wing Chun background, I found the material to be presented in, what was to me, a very nice understandable way. While I still have questions, I believe that my body will, through practice, answer many of those questions for me. Plus, visiting and training with Guru Derric will doubtless keep me on track. It is hard to realize right off just how much material is actually presented in the DLP DVD's. It is kind of like mining for gold. Sometimes you miss what is right in front of you until you go back again and again. All in all I would highly recommend the DLP to others and will do so as I feel it covers a lot of material and is presented in an easily understood fashion. Also, the presentation is very laid back and you can see that those in the art enjoy life.
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Hello Tim,Thanks for the reply, I admit to being unfamiliar with several of the "signature" techniques as well as the principles your reference. I guess I will have a lot to learn. Looking forward to it!!!!Maybe I am missing something but it seems that AKTS would be a conceptual art based on principles and how they are applied within the system. Without being difficult, could you explain a different approach rather than principleconceptual or technique based. It may be me, but I am having difficulty understanding an approach which does not fall into one of these two catagories. Just trying to digest some things before I get a chance to actually start training, hopefully this coming weekend will be my first time.
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Hello,I would be hard pressed to claim to be a practicianer of Kuntao Silat as I am just now starting to explore the art. However, I have always heard good things about the art and the skill of those practicing it. My primary art is Wing Chun and I feel that this blends well with AKTS. However, as I am still a complete infant/babe I will have to wait and see if this is true. I am also excited about the prospect of training and learning with those of a Christian Moral Background as most of the arts from this region which I have trained previously, Pekiti Tirsia, could hardly be considered "Christian" in nature. As a matter of fact, after certain levels if you are not of the same "religousphiloshpical" bent your progress will cease. Anyhow, to answer the question:The reason I am now interested in studying AKTS is because of its combat efficiency, the strong moral character of those who practice and the flexibility and fluidity of the art itself.
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Hello,I will definitely be looking for further details. While I am new and just now exploring Kuntao, I have great respect for the art. I remember when I met my friend and Pekiti Tirsia trainer, AK, that he initially told me that he did Silat. I asked if it was under the De Thours brothers and he looked at me shocked that I had heard of them, this was around 1987 or so. He trained Silat with Eddie Jafrie but had great respect for KTS. I have trained in Wing Chun and that is my core art. I have also trained in Pekiti Tirsia and explored some Silat and Kuntao. However the opportunity to explore AKTS is truly an exciting prospect for me. From the little I have seen, this art is very effective and blends well with how I do Wing Chun. I look forward to learning more and hopefully becoming a part of this "family" as well. Peace,Dave
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Hello,Yes, a very interesting read and very viable for understanding the right to defend ones self. I have always found that ones motivation is the over riding factor in whether something is acceptable or not. Even Jesus got mad at the Money Changers in the Temple and threw them out......certainly not a Self Defense situation but it can show that sometimes force is needed at times. FWIW, I believe that many who opt for the pacifist approach do not truly understand the "Turn the other Cheek" teachings. While the Bible does teach that it is better to repay evil with good, it also teaches that there is a time for everything, including War. If one believes the Bible is true then one must accept that God is not only Loving but Just. A part of Justice is discipline. Also, when attacked one does have a right to defend oneself. Of course, it would be better to be able to convert the attacker and convince them of the error of their ways, but that is not always possible nor prudent. I believe that there is nothing wrong with defending oneself or ones loved ones if attacked. Of course I also believe that such defense should be proportionate to the attack. Just because one has the means to kill does not mean that such a reaction is always justified. Sorry if I ramble on a bit. Peace,Dave
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